Borderblaster (SNA) // La Cuatro (Vol. 1-4)

7/22/2019 Borderblaster (SNA) // La Cuatro (Vol. 1-4)

1/208

BORDERBLASTER (SNA) //

LA CUATRO


2/208

VOL. I - IV

LA CUATRO

Borderblaster (SNA) rene los testimonios

orales de residentes, artistas, lideres

comunitarios y dueos de negocios en la Calle

Cuatro, para reflexionar sobre los efectos

sociales, culturales y econmicos de la

reurbanizacin en el Centro de Santa Ana.

Las narrativas fueron divididas en cuatro

volmenes de transcripciones bilinges

(reunidos aqu), y se colocaron en negocios de

la Calle Cuatro para proporcionar contexto

histrico y personal acerca del Centro de la

ciudad.

Para ms informacin, por favor visite:

borderblaster.tumblr.com

Borderblaster (SNA)collects the oral

testimonies of local residents, artists,

community leaders and 4th Street business

owners to reflect on the economic, social, and

cultural dimensions of redevelopment in the

Downtown core of Santa Ana.

These narratives were divided into four

volumes of bilingual transcriptions (compiled

here), and were placed in shops along 4th

Street to provide historical and personal

context about the heart of Downtown.

For more information, please visit:

borderblaster.tumblr.com


3/208


4/208

VOL. I --

CONTEXTO

CONTEXT


5/208


6/208

5

01. For me this was this was an area [that] was aminor miracle -- especially in Orange County,

[where] we always just like to bulldoze

everything, everything, everything,everything. This is one of the few original

downtowns left in Orange County. You have

Fullerton, you have Old Town Orange, you

have Laguna Beach to an extent, but those

buildings are not that old. Maybe Huntington

Beach, but again, all of that has been bulldozed

one way or another, and here you have an

extant downtown. Who saved it? It wasMexicans.

You had all the white fl ight from Santa Ana in

the 60s and in the 70s. Who came in and

saved it? Mexicans. Because they came at a

time when no one else wanted to be here. I

honestly think, all these hipster businesses,

they need to acknowledge those immigrantsthat stayed here, and rented out these spots.

Imagine if the Mexicans wouldn't have come

in. Irv Chase and all those people, they'd have

to level all this, and say, "All right, here well

have--whatever buildings they used in the

80s, shopping plazas, or malls, or whatever.

Para mi esto era una rea que era como un

pequeo milagro -- especialmente en Orange

County, donde nos gusta sencillamente

derribar todo, todo, todo, todo. Este es uno delos nicos centros originales que queda en

Orange County. Tienes a Fullerton, tienes [al

centro de] Orange, hasta cierto punto, tienes a

Huntington Beach, pero esos edificios no son

tan viejos. Tal vez Huntington Beach, pero

como dije, todo ha sido derrumbado de una

forma u otra. Y aqu tienes un centro todava

existente. Quin lo salv? Fueron losMexicanos.

En los aos 60 y 70 se fueron los Anglosajones

de Santa Ana. Quin entr y la salv? Los

Mexicanos. Porque llegaron en un tiempo

cuando nadie quera estar aqu. Y

honestamente creo que todos estos negocios

hipster, tienen que reconocer a losinmigrantes que se quedaron aqu, y rentaron

estos locales. Imagnense que los Mexicanos

no hubieran llegado. Irv Chase, y toda esa

gente tendran que nivelar todo esto, y decir,

bueno, tendremos-- los edificios que usaban

en los 80 centros de compras, o lo que sea.


7/208

6

So in that sense, I always viewed Downtown

Santa Ana as, not a last stand, per se, but as a

great testament to Mexicans in Orange

County. Now, again, that's being changed.People are belittling those Mexicans that kept

all those buildings around here. I think that's

such a shame, but that's so OC, that's so

Orange County: to not know it's history, to

belittle the Mexicans, and then to get rid of

what was there, to go forward and not look

back.

- Local Author + Journalist

As que, en ese sentido el Centro de Santa Ana

siempre me pareci, quizs no una ltima

resistencia, pero un gran testimonio de los

Mexicanos en Orange County. Ahora, denuevo, esto est cambiando. La gente est

menospreciando a los mismos Mexicanos que

aseguraron la sobrevivencia del Centro. Creo

que es una lstima enorme, pero es tpico del

condado de Orange: no saber su propia

historia, menospreciar a los Mexicanos,

demoler lo que haba, seguir hacia adelante, y

no mirar atrs.

- Autor + Periodista Local


8/208

7

02. LA2: This is a place that has been very hostileto anybody of Latin descent, anybody who

looks Mexican, anybody who looks Latin,

whether you are or not. This has been a very,historically, a very oppressive and very harsh

and confrontational place for that population.

LA1: I mean, Orange County in general, and

Santa Ana, less so because it wasone of the

few places where Latinos could own land,

because of [racially restrictive] covenants.

- Local Artists [#1, #2]

AL2: Este es un lugar que ha sido muy hostil

para cualquier persona de origen Latino,

cualquier persona que parezca ser Mexicano,

que parezca ser Latino, aunque sea o no. Estelugar es, histricamente un lugar muy

opresivo, muy duro, de confrontaciones para

esa poblacin.

AL1: Digo, Orange County por lo general, y

Santa Ana menos porque erauno de los

nicos lugares donde los Latinos podan ser

propietarios de tierra, por los convenios[restrictivos raciales].

- Artistas Locales [#1, #2]


9/208

8

03. Miren, en 1898 mi abuelo trajo a mi padre a laedad de 5 aos de Guanajuato a Riverside. De

Riverside como en 1912 a Santa Ana, en el

Barrio Logan. En 1920, mis padres se casaron;hicieron su vida en el barrio. Compraron su

casa all porque no permitan que comprara

casas las raza de uno, afuera de los barrios.

Crec yo, cuando fui al knder[garden],

adelante, era escuela para Mexicans. Fui a la

Willard que es la Junior High School. Es la

primera vez que me junt con gringitos y nos

hicimos muy amigos.

La primera vez que nos venamos juntos aqu

para ver el cine el sbado a las dos de la tarde,

que tena especial para los chamacos, a mi me

echaron para arriba en el cine, y a los

gringitos abajo. Los gringitos estaban

confundidos porque nunca les haba sucedido

a ellos. Nosotros automticamente ya nossubamos arriba, porque as ya estbamos

acostumbrados. En ese tiempo no se daba

cuenta que es discriminacin. No ms que

vivamos en ese barrio y la situacin del cine y

todo eso.

In 1898 my grandfather brought my five-year

old dad from Guanajuato [Mexico] to

Riverside. In about 1912, they moved from

Riverside to the Logan neighborhood in SantaAna. My parents got married in 1920, they

made a life for themselves in that

neighborhood. They bought a house there

because Mexicans werent allowed to buy a

house outside those neighborhoods. I grew up,

and went to kindergarden, the school I went to

was for Mexicans. Then I went to Willard,

which was the Junior High School. It was thefirst time that I met gringitos [White kids],

and we became good friends.

The first time that we went to the movies

together--on Saturdays at two in the afternoon

they had a special for kids -- they made me sit

upstairs and the gringitos downstairs. The

gringitoswere really confused, because it hadnever happened to them before. We

automatically went upstairs, because we were

used to it. In those days, nobody realized that

its discrimination. It was just that we lived in

that neighborhood, and those were the rules of

the movie theater, and other things.


10/208

9

Me gradu de la Santa Ana High School,

nosotros no tenamos dinero, mi familia,

entonces yo me fui al militar. En 1958, en

agosto sal del militar, ya estaba casado. Y yoy mi seora decidimos rentar un

departamento. El dueo dice, No le rentamos

a Mexicans. Ok, sigui la vida de nosotros.

Tuvimos una nia; pas el tiempo. Hace como

aproximadamente treinta y tres aos pasados,

me llam mi madre: Hijo hijo, nos quieren

correr del barrio. Barrio Logan. Que?

Entonces uno empieza a pensar. Mis padres,ya viejitos, compraron ah porque no les

dejaban rentar en otro lugar, y ahora los

querran correr. Yo lo vea, como dijo Zapata,

tierra sagrada y todo eso, el movimiento este.

- Dueo de Negocio en la Calle Cuatro +

Activista

I graduated from Santa Ana High School, and

my family, we didnt have money, so I went

into the army. In August of 1958, I got out of

the army and I got married. My wife and Idecided to rent an apartment. [But] the owner

said, We dont rent to Mexians. Ok, our lives

went on. We had a little girl; time went by.

Then, about thirty-three years ago, my mother

called me up, Son, son, they want to kick us

out of the neighborhood. Out of Logan.

What? So you start to think. My parents,

who by then were well into their senior years,had bought a house there because they

couldnt rent anywhere else, and now they

wanted to kick them out. I saw it, like

[Emiliano] Zapata said, tierra sagrada

[sacred earth] and all that: this is part of that

movement.

"4

th

Street Business Owner and Activist


11/208

10

04. LA1: One thing that I realized about 4th Street-- the night that I saw people coming in and

peeing all over the street from the bars, and

then the next day I went out there early in themorning and saw all the merchants cleaning it

up with the pine-sol and what not -- as I took a

look down the street, I realized that this is the

American Dream. It's merchants, small

businesses. It's a very romantic street. So I

called it a Street of Dreams. You can come

here, you can buy a wedding ring, or an

engagement ring, a dress, perfume, a cake, awedding cake, a tres lechescake, catering, an

immigration lawyer, a travel agent ---

LA2: You can even get married on the street --

LA1: tickets to book your entire family to

come in from Sinaloa or whatever --

LA2: Or go on your honeymoon --

LA1: All on this street. It is a complete

ecosystem.

AL1: Me di cuenta de algo en cuanto a la Calle

Cuatro -- la noche en la que vi a gente que

viene a los bares orinando por toda la calle, y

al prximo da vi a los comercianteslimpindola con Pinol y cosas as por la

maana -- al mirar la calle, me di cuenta que

es el sueo americano. Son comerciantes,

negocios pequeos. Es una calle muy

romntica. As que la llam la Calle de los

Sueos. Puedes venir aqu, puedes comprar

un anillo de matrimonio, o un anillo de

compromiso, un vestido, perfume, un pastel,un pastel de bodas -- y no slo un pastel sino

servicio de comida y bebida, un abogado de

inmigracin, un agente de viajes --

AL2: Hasta te puedes casar en la calle.

AL1: Pasajes para que tu familia entera venga

de Sinaloa, o de donde sea --

AL2: O para irte a tu luna de miel --

AL1: Toda en esta calle. Es un ecosistema

completo.


12/208

11

AL2: And there's a capilla [chapel] here too.

You can get married on the street.

LA1: Yeah, there's a capilla. There's like sevensalones [halls] here. You can have your

reception. So everything that is self-contained

in a community exists on this street. Why

would you want to take that away? Why

wouldn't you want to promote that, and

expand on it?

Even that 99 Cents store has like Djequipment and stuff --

LA2: I cannot believe everything the 99 Cent

store next to the Yost has. I was just floored. I

was amazed. Go in there, I cannot believe it.

LA1: Electronics.

LA2: Just, oh man, it's amazing! That place is

amazing. So, yeah, there's a lot of little

treasures.

- Local Artists [#1, #2]

AL2: Y hay una capilla aqu, tambin. Te

puedes casar en esta calle.

AL1: S, hay una capilla. Hay como sietesalones aqu. Puedes tener tu recepcin de

bodas. As que todo lo que es una comunidad

auto-suficiente existe en esta calle. Por qu

quisieran quitar eso? Por qu no quisieran

promover y ampliarlo?

Hasta hay una tienda de 99 Centavos que

tiene equipo de Dj y cosas --

AL2: No puedo creer todo lo que tiene la tienda

de 99 Centavos que queda al lado del Yost.

Quede asombrada. Entr ah, y no lo poda

creer.

AL1: Electrnicos.

AL2: Es maravilloso! Ese lugar es

maravilloso. As que, s, hay muchos tesoros

pequeos.

- Artistas Locales [#1, #2]


13/208

12

05. When immigrants first come to this country,the very first thing they traditionally do is

find a place of worship, worship like in their

own country. But then, the next thing they dois set up a shop. It's usually food; I'm more

familiar with the food aspect. But somebody

comes around and starts offering the goods

that you can't find in mainstream society, but

that you can find in this particular area. So

merchants are very often the repositories of

culture.

It's very easy for the Left to dismiss

merchants, 'Oh, evil capitalists, blah blah blah

blah blah." But they keep culture. The

merchants made this area a Mexican area

when it wasn't a Mexican area. It wasn't just

normal people. It was the merchants, who

then allowed the normal people to come in and

shop and, basically, be Mexican, proudly for a

weekend: llendo de compras, going on

shopping, and all that. In that sense, it's very

significant--just like South Coast Plaza is a

place for people to aspire to be rich and, also

for rich people to be able to shop.

Cuando recin llegan los inmigrantes a este

pas, lo primero que hacen, tradicionalmente,

es encontrar un lugar para practicar su

religin, como lo hacan en su tierra. Peroluego, la prxima cosa es abrir tiendas. Suelen

ser de comida; estoy ms familiarizado con lo

de la comida. Pero alguien llega y empieza a

ofrecer productos que no se encuentra en la

sociedad convencional, pero s se encuentran

en esta zona en particular. As que los

comerciantes son repositorios de cultura.

Es fcil que la izquierda poltica menosprecia a

comerciantes -- oh capitalistas malvolos, bla

bla bl -- pero son guardianes de la cultura. Los

comerciantes hicieron que esta zona fuese

Mexicana, cuando no era Mexicana. No fue

cualquiera. Fueron los comerciantes quienes

permitieron que la gente comn viniera, que

fueran de compras, que pudieran ser,

bsicamente, orgullosamente Mexicanos, por

un fin de semana: yendo de compras. En es

sentido es muy significativo--as como South

Coast plaza es un lugar para que la gente

aspire a ser rico, y tambin para que la gente

rica pueda ir de compras.


14/208

13

The merchant class is very important in

setting an identity for a region, and, also, as

an economic engine. I think it was as recently

as 2005, 2004, this downtown area with allthose immigrants, it was the second largest

merchant tax-base in Santa Ana next to Main

Place Mall. It was a money making machine.

The city depended on it to be able to be a city.

Of course, no one cares about those

arguments. But it's necessary to give those

people their due.

- Local Author + Journalist

La clase comerciante es muy importante

cuando se trata de establecer una identidad

para una regin; y tambin es un motor

econmico. Creo que recientemente, en 2005 o2004, el Centro -- con todos sus inmigrantes --

era la segunda base mercantil de impuestos

ms grande en Santa Ana, aparte de Main

Place Mall. Era una maquina de ganancias. La

ciudad dependa de la zona para ser ciudad.

Claro, a nadie le importa argumentos as. Pero

es necesario darle a esa gente lo que merecen.

- Autor + Periodista Local


15/208

14

06. Downtown Santa Ana, as you probably alreadytalked to a lot of people, like many Downtowns

throughout the United States in the 60s, had a

decline. Disinvestment of city resources forcommercial activity, you started to have more

minorities -- African Americans and Latinos --

living around downtowns, around the same

time. So you have the so-called White flight.

You started to have a lot of vacant properties

throughout the United States. You hear about

Detroit a lot, downtown LA, and Santa Ana

was no different in many ways.

In the 60s you will read a lot of documents and

people will talk about how the 60s was a ghost

town, or at least towards the end of it. And

Santa Ana has been since the late 1800s early

1900s hundreds, in to the 50s -- in Orange

County there weren't that many cities, so

Santa Ana and Anaheim were the main ones --

seen as a hub. You have the Civic Center that

was a county seat, so that's where everybody

would go shop. It's like the middle class and

White identity.

El Centro de Santa Ana, como ya les habr

dicho mucha gente, sufri una decada en los

60s, tal como les pas a muchos centros de

ciudades a lo largo de Estados Unidos en esapoca: dejaron de invertir los recursos de la

ciudad en los centros, bajo la actividad

comercial, y a la vez empezamos a ver ms

minoras -- Afroamericanos y Latinos --

establecindose en el centro. Sucede lo que se

llama White flight [mudanza en masa de

Anglosajones fuera del centro de la ciudad]. Se

empieza a ver muchas propiedades vacas a lolargo de Estados Unidos. Se escucha hablar de

Detroit, del centro de Los Angeles, y en Santa

Ana pas lo mismo de muchas maneras.

Pueden leer en muchos documentos y tambin

la gente hablar de que era una ciudad

fantasma durante los 60s, o por lo menos al

final de la dcada empez a ser. Y desde el

final de los 1800s y el principio de los 1900 y

hasta los 50, Santa Ana ha sido -- en Orange

Countyno haba muchas ciudades, as que las

principales eran Santa Ana y Anaheim -- como

un ncleo. El centro cvico era la sede del

condado, por lo tanto todo el mundo


16/208

15

That started changing in the late 60s. By the

early 70s, you started to see a shift in the type

of business and the demographic that is

claiming space in the area. It's Latinos,Mexicanos, working class immigrants,

primarily. Then you have some long standing,

second generation Mexican-Americans at that

time.

So the Canada was one of the first major big

stores that serves as an indicator that there's

a shift here -- the major shoe store in Mexico,

is opening up a Canada on 4th and Main. They

must know something, or they're banking on

something.

From the 70s, there are only two businesses

that I can recall and say, and reflect now, I

talk about one--because I'm putting together a

book on this--Woolworth's. Have you guys ever

seen a Woolworth's? You guys are too young.

Yeah, you've seen one?

AYS: I saw the very, very tail-end of a

Woolworth's.

iba de compras all. Era como la identidad de

la clase media Anglosajona.

Eso empez a cambiar a finales de la dcada60. A principios de los 70, empiezas a ver un

cambio en trminos del tipo de negocio y tipo

de gente que ocupa el espacio en la regin.

Principalmente son Latinos, Mexicanos,

inmigrantes de la clase obrera. En esa poca

tambin surgen algunos Mxico-Americanos

de segunda generacin.

As que la tienda Canada era una de las

primeras tiendas grandes, seala un cambio

aqu -- la gran tienda de calzados mexicanos

est abriendo una sede en La Cuatro y Main.

Deben saber algo, o estn contando con algo.

Solo puedo pensar en dos negocios de los 70--

hablar de uno porque de eso estoy

componiendo un libro--Woolworths. Alguna

vez han visto un Woolworths? Son

demasiados jvenes. S, has visto uno?

AYS: Vi uno en sus ltimos das.


17/208

16

You saw the tail-end? Ok. So you kind of have

a sense. Woolworth's was where Fallas

Paredes is, on 4th Street, that whole place was

Woolworth's. It has a diner, do you guysremember-- you guys don't remember Mel's

Diner, in the 80s, the show, you guys ever see

that?

Well that's like your traditional 50s diner. The

women would put their hair up, like do their

hair up, and aprons, and that was your

traditional American store. It had a diner. And

these are all throughout the United States:

Woolworth's. I think Woolworth's closed in-- it

probably closed like in 1988-1990. Then

there was another place, it was a tuxedo shop,

I think it was called Gary's Tuxedo Shop.

Those are pretty famous; that one was next to

Starbucks. So those are two that, over time,

growing up and as I reflect, they were

probably the last indicators that served a

different demographic, one that proceeded the

predominant Mexicano, imigrante, working

poor, working class population.

- Professor + 4thStreet Historian

Viste sus ltimos das? Bien. Entonces ms o

menos sabes. Woolworths estaba ubicado en

donde se encuentra Fallas Paredes en La

Cuatro, ese edifico entero era Woolworths.Tenia una cafetera, se acuerdan ustedes de--

no se acordarn de Mels Diner, de los 80s, la

serie, alguna vez la vieron?

Bueno, es como la cafetera tradicional de los

50s. Las mujeres se recogan el pelo, tenan

estos peinados, y mandiles, y esta era la

tienda tradicional americana. Tena una

cafetera. Y se encontraban a lo largo de

Estados Unidos: Woolworths. Creo que

Woolworths cerr en -- probablemente cerr

entre 1980 y 1990. Haba otro local, era una

tienda de smokings, se llamaba Garys Tuxedo

Shop, creo. Son bastante famosos; esa estaba

ubicado al lado de Starbucks. As que esas

eran dos que, fueron los ltimos indicadores

que servan a otra poblacin, una que precede

a la que ahora es predominante: la poblacin

Mexicana, inmigrante, de bajos recursos, de

clase obrera.

- Profesor + Historiador de la Calle Cuatro


18/208

17

07. Here are the demographics, we know that thisis who we serve: 68% of the kids that attend

our programs fall below the Federal Poverty

Line. Their families make less than $20,000 ayear. In Orange County, I can't think of a lot of

families that can survive off $20,000 a year.

There should be an award for families for

being able to do that, because it is definitely

not easy.

It's a rich county. Just rent alone--although

it's Santa Ana--is really not that much cheaper

than living in a different area. How families

are able to survive in this type of environment

is by sharing an apartment, or living in one

room as a family. This multiple-families-in-a-

dwelling is kind of a normal thing to this

neighborhood.

Let's look at what else is impacted. The quality

of food is going to be affected. You're not

eating, you're not shopping at Whole Foods, so

typically the options that you have available

to you are limited. If you're sharing an

apartment with multiple families, you

typically don't have your own refrigerator so

Estos son los datos demogrficos, esta es la

gente que atendemos: el 68% de los nios que

asisten a nuestros programas se encuentran

por debajo de la lnea de pobreza federal. Susfamilias ganan menos de $20,000 al ao.

Debera de haber un premio para familias por

hacer eso, porque definitivamente no es fcil.

Es un distrito rico. Solo el alquiler--aunque sea

Santa Ana--no es mucho ms barato que vivir

en otra zona. Las familias logran sobrevivir en

un ambiente como este compartiendo un

departamento, o viviendo, toda la familia en

una sola habitacin. Este tipo de mltiples-

familias-en-una-vivienda es una cosa normal

en esta comunidad.

Consideremos las otras cosas afectadas. La

calidad de comida se va a ver afectada. No

come, no va de compras a Whole Foods; as que

tpicamente las opciones que tiene son

limitadas. Si comparte un apartamento con

mltiples familias, comnmente no tiene su

propio refrigerador, as que no puede comprar

en grandes cantidades como otras familias

para ahorrar dinero.


19/208

18

you can't shop the way that other families

may shop, and buy in bulk and save money

that way.

The other thing to consider is transportation.

A lot of families don't have an actual vehicle

that they can use as transportation. That

means that everything that you have to do in

order to survive has to be within walking

distance. That means you have to shop a lot

smaller than normal because you're going to

have to walk it home. That means that you're

going to have to shop at whatever stores are

within a few block radius of you. And

depending on what store you're shopping

from, they may take advantage of that, and

they may hike up their prices and offer lower

quality products. That's just something that

you have to put up with.

As a child growing up in a home with so many

people, not only is that not an ideal

environment to grow up in, but it's also a

pretty big safety concern. You're living with

other people that are strangers in some cases.

La otra cosa que hay que considerar es el

transporte. Muchas familias no tienen un

vehculo propio que pueden usar como

transporte. Significa que tiene que poderllegar a pie a casi todo lo que uno ocupa para

sobrevivir. Significa que hay que comprar en

cantidades ms pequeas que lo normal,

porque hay que llevarlo a casa. Significa que

hay que ir de compras en cualquier tienda que

quede a pocas cuadras de donde uno vive.

Dependiendo de la tienda, se pueden

aprovechar de eso, y pueden subir los precios

y ofrecer productos de calidad ms baja. Eso

es algo que uno tiene que aguantarse.

Como nio, creciendo en una casa con tantas

personas, no es un ambiente ideal para crecer,

y tambin representa un problema de

seguridad bastante grande. Uno est viviendo

con otras personas, que en algunos casos son

desconocidos.

Es una comunidad transitoria. La gente se

muda mucho.


20/208

19

It's a transient community. You move around

a lot. Ideal scenario, you pick a house and you

live there, and you grow up in that house, you

grow old and maybe someday you pass that

house on to your kids. That doesn't happen

here. You're renting an apartment, or you're

renting a room. Those circumstances are

always changing...

- Community After-School Program Director

En un escenario ideal, escoges una casa, vives

en ella, creces en esa casa, y te envejeces, y un

da tal vez se la pasas a tus nios. Aqu eso no

pasa. Estas rentando un apartamento, o una

habitacin. Son circunstancias que siempre

estn cambiando

- Director de Programa Comunitario para

Jovenes


21/208

20

08. I created three [Downtown] zones: the EastEnd, which used to be Fiesta Marketplace, La

Cuatro, and then the Artist's Village. I wanted

to see what type of businesses and amenities

existed. I created typologies, based on the

creative class. You guys are familiar with the

creative cities concept, and all that? I used a

lot of that literature to help me make sense of

it, and to see what's there.

I couldn't document change. I mean I could do

this in another two years. I could start

documenting the change every so often. But

La Cuatro, as a whole, I argue based on -- I

did my analysis -- it still maintains, its

targeting the working class, Mexicano

population. Where the gentrification, the

changes are occurring, as I'm saying, or

encroaching, is around the edges, it's the East

End or the Artist's Village. That's where its at.

The main changes, in terms of the types of

businesses and amenities that are on 4th,

they're on the edges, because they're spilling

and growing from these zones that are on the

edges, for the most part. When we look for

Divid [el Centro] en tres zonas: el East End,

que antes era Fiesta Marketplace, La Cuatro,

y el Artists Village. Quera ver que tipo de

negocios y servicios existan. Hice tipologas,

basadas en la clase creativa. Ustedes conocen

el concepto de ciudades creativas? Utilic

mucha de esa literatura para ayudar aclarar

lo que estaba pasando, y para ver lo que

estaba all.

No podra documentar cambios. Digo, lo podra

hacer en otros dos aos. Podra empezar a

documentar los cambios de vez en cuando.

Pero argumento que La Cuatro, como

unidad, basado en mi anlisis -- sigue

atendiendo a las necesidades de la clase

obrera, la poblacin Mexicana. Donde s, digo

que estn ocurriendo cambios,

aburguesamiento, o donde s est

acercndose, es en sus extremidades: en el

East Endo en elArtists Village. Ah es donde

se encuentra.

Los cambios principales, en trminos de los

negocios y los servicios en La Cuatro se

encuentran en sus limites, porque en mayor


22/208

21

patterns, that's what I found. Not too novel, I

think. But I don't know if anybody's shared it

that way.

Of course they say, oh, the whole Cuatro." I

think the Cuatros on the verge of

gentrification. Businesses are changing on the

edges and its encroaching, and it might lead

and keep on going. You see a pattern, in terms

of the changes, that's what I'm seeing. It's

more encroaching, gentrification encroaching,

the way I call it.

Over all, La Cuatro has maintained its

identity in terms of marketing, and having

businesses and amenities that target the

working class mexicano population that had

its genesis, I argue, prominently from 73

onward.

- Professor + 4thStreet Historian

parte se estn extendiendo de, y creciendo de

las zonas fronterizas. Cuando buscamos

patrones, eso es lo que encontr. No es nada

nuevo, creo. Pero no creo que otros lo hayan

explicado de esa manera.

Claro, hay quienes dicen, oh, es La Cuatro

entera. La Cuatro est por experimentar

aburguesamiento, creo. Los negocios en sus

extremidades estn cambiando, y se est

acercando, y tal vez siga. Se ve un patrn, en

trminos de cambios, eso es lo que yo veo. Se

trata ms de un acercamiento, yo lo explicara

ms como el aburguesamiento invadiendo.

Por lo general, La Cuatro ha mantenido su

identidad en trminos de publicidad, y de

tener negocios y servicios para la clase obrera

Mexicana, cuyo origen, sostengo yo, es del 73

en adelante.

- Profesor + Historiador de la Calle Cuatro


23/208

22

09. Things happen, powers exercised, and peopleare able to gain economically in different

ways. It's not as blatant an obvious as it used

to be. That's the main point that I want to

convey. For example, in downtown areas, you

see new urbanists re-development, new

urbanism models. What is that? Primarily it's

urban design. Architects, urban designers and

planners get together: how do you reshape,

physically, an area? Work/live lofts. I mean

you've got to get the artist's in there.

Work-live lofts and zones in the way that only

particular businesses can be there. Work live

lofts are for single families, we're going to

have families of four or five, primarily

younger or way older, empty nesters.

That's a particular demographic that you are

envisioning and planning for physically. The

open spaces for social interaction that

complements these work/live lofts, and

amenities--such as restaurants cafes, where

people can hang out and congregate. They're

not big parks: they're not for families. So,

you're not for the working class, Mexicanoin

Pasan las cosas, el poder se manifiesta, y la

gente encuentra formas de ganar dinero de

distintas maneras. No es tan descarado y

obvio como sola ser anteriormente. Eso es el

punto principal que quiero comunicar. Por

ejemplo, en el Centro ves que la renovacin

sigue los principios y los modelos del nuevo

urbanismo. Qu es eso? Principalmente es

diseo urbano. Arquitectos, diseadores

urbanos, y planificadores se renen: cmo se

remodela una regin en trminos fsicos?

Work/live lofts [apartamentos estilo loft].

Digo, hay que atraer a los artistas.

Work/live lofts y la zonificacin, de forma que

slo ciertos negocios puedan establecerse all.

Work/live lofts son unifamiliares, vamos a

tener familias de cuatro o cinco,

principalmente jvenes of mucho mayores,

con nidos vacos.

Planificas y conceptualizas una zona fsica

especficamente para esa poblacin. Los

espacios abiertos para la interaccin social

que complementan a loswork/live lofts, y los

servicios acompaantes como restaurantes


24/208

23

Santa Ana. But all the artists and new

urbanists design is laced with positive,

normative principles of social interaction--

relive, revive the downtown core, which is a

lot of the creative city creative class stuff, and

conjoined with new urbanists.

You design and you complement physical

urban design with creative class-- meaning

promoting the arts, bringing people that are

tolerant of other cultures, having people who

are creative, and work with their minds

versus laborers, [e.g.] software engineer

developers. And people congregating and

having a nightlife for areas that didn't have a

thriving nightlife before. I think culture

programming [becomes] places to interact--

that that is what we see in Santa Ana. And

also the urbanist's redevelopment and what

they want to do. Santa Ana has both.

And then they start springing up, little by

little. Oh, look it looks nicer. Then another

one pops up. Then money goes out-- the PBID

[Property Based Improvement District tax on

Downtown businesses] happens.

tipo caf, donde la gente se junta y se rene.

No son parques grandes: no son para familias.

Por lo tanto no es para la clase obrera,

Mexicana en Santa Ana. A pesar de eso, el

diseo de los artistas y los del nuevo

urbanismo est saturado con principios

normativos positivos de la interaccin social:

de hacer renacer, de reanimar al ncleo del

centro, lo que tiene mucho que ver con los

conceptos de ciudades creativas, y clases

creativas, junto a lo del urbanismo nuevo.

Diseas y combinas el diseo urbano fsico con

lo de la clase creativa -- es decir la promocin

de las artes, cuando traes a gente tolerante de

otras culturas, cuando atraes a gente creativa,

quienes trabajan con la mente [como]

ingenieros de software, en vez de obreros -- y

que la gente se junte y que prospere la vida

nocturna donde antes no haba. Creo que la

programacin cultural tiene mucho que ver

con la creacin de lugares para tener

interacciones sociales. Esto es lo que esta

pasando en Santa Ana. Pero tambin la

renovacin de los urbanistas, y lo que ellos

quieren hacer. Santa Ana tiene las dos cosas.


25/208

24

All this movement happens over time, and it's

not, like I said, it's not: knocking down this,

let's go fight and protest!

Power manifests itself more complexly. Like

Foucault and all those other people talk about,

governmentality. I do that type of analysis on

some of these plans, and that's when you see

what happens, little by little: manipulation,

people in cahoots, PBID, only property owners

could be part of it, but then you get the token

business owners to be in it that are Latino.

They'll talk about, I resigned because they

weren't being listened to. But even there, you

question perpetuating, what kind of

programming are you looking for? Who

knows, but I'm assuming, this goes back to

class. Would people have a problem if a high-

end area catering to middle/upper class

mexicanoswith money were there? Should we

have a Gucci Mexico there? Would that be

appropriate? Is that okay? See, now we get

into class. People are not talking about that.

- Professor + 4th Street Historian

Y despus empiezan a aparecer de a poco. Oh,

miren, se ve mejor. Despus aparece otro.

Despus se va el dinero-- pasa lo de PBID

[Distrito para Mejoras Basadas en

Propiedades, un tax a negocios en el Centro].

Se mueve todo de paso en paso, y no es, como

dije: Derrumbaron esto: pues vamos a luchar

y a protestar!

El poder se manifiesta de formas ms

complejas. Como dice Foucault y todos los

dems, gubernamentalidad. Analizo algunos

de los planes de esa forma, y all uno ve lo que

de a poco est pasando: la manipulacin, la

gente en confabulacin, PBID, solo podan

participar dueos de propiedades, tambin

algunos comerciantes Latinos simblicos.

Y hasta despus dicen Renunci porque no

los estaban escuchando. Pero an as, hay

que cuestionar la perpetuacin qu tipo de

programacin ests buscando? Quin sabe,

pero creo que va de vuelta a clase

[econmica].


26/208

25

La gente tendra problemas si se creara ah

una zona elite, que atendiera a las necesidades

de Mexicanos de la clases media/alta con

dinero? Deberamos de tener un Gucci

Mxico all? Sera apropiado eso? Ven, ahora

se trata de clase. La gente no habla de eso.

- Profesor + Historiados de la Calle Cuatro


27/208

26

10. MGD: Based on what you've seen here in SantaAna, and maybe based on your own work in

LA, what do you find as the primary driving

force [behind gentrification], or a couple of

them?

That's an excellent question, and if you talk to

one gentrification researcher and you talk to

another one, you're going to get very different

opinions, depending on their theoretical

framework. There's a big debate within the

gentrification literature about what causes

gentrification. There's even another debate

about stages, and each one of these stages,

there's different sets of actors that are

involved, and you can kind of skip around and

start from one stage, and then go to a different

stage, depending on what kind of historical

period you're in, and what's moving the

cutting-edge of development at that particular

moment.

The big split is some of the stuff that really

comes out of Marxist geography. The Marxist

geographers have this idea of a spatial fix.

They use that fix in the sense of, like an

MGD: Basado en lo que has visto aqu en Santa

Ana, y tal vez basado en tu propio trabajo en

Los Angeles, qu encuentras que es la fuerza

propulsora principal [del aburguesamiento], o

un par de ellas?

Es una pregunta excelente, y si hablas con un

investigador de aburguesamiento, y despus

con otro, vas a recibir dos opiniones muy

distintas, dependiendo de sus marcos tericos.

Dentro de la literatura de aburguesamiento, se

debate mucho sus causas. Se discute en

trminos de etapas, y en cada etapa hay

distintos actores involucrados, y puedes saltar

entre las etapas, y empezar de cualquier, y

despus saltar a otra, dependiendo de la poca

histrica, y de que, en ese tiempo, este

impulsando el desarrollo ms reciente.

La gran separacin se debe a algunas de las

cosas que vienen de la geografa marxista. Los

gegrafos marxistas creen en lo que se llama

una dosis espacial [spatial fix]. Usandosis en

el sentido de que, como un adicto, es alguien

que slo quiere la prxima dosis de drogas

para sobrevivir. La idea es que el capitalismo


28/208

27

addict, is somebody that's just trying to get the

next fix to get them by. The idea is that

capitalism functions in this way. It's a spatial

fix, so that the way that capitalism's been able

to survive, and not just crash, is that it

periodically solves its crises through different

geographic formations.

Marxist geographers who have looked at

gentrification are saying, since the 1970s,

capitalism has gone into a different mode of

where it's moved away from -- or not

necessarily moved away -- but that it's

returned to the city, the central areas of cities

that were disinvested, for the most part,

during the earlier periods of capitalist

development. They're returning to those

because location and proximity are much

more important in the production of value

today. So that's one argument, and there's

more to that. But that's just sort of the surface

of it.

There's another argument that really says

that it's all these new consumers, and people

with different consumer choices who want to

funciona de la misma forma. Es una dosis

espacial, por lo tanto la forma en la que el

capitalismo sobrevive: no se estrella porque

resuelve sus crisis a travs de peridicamente

buscar y tomar distintas formaciones

geogrficas.

Gegrafos marxistas que han estudiado el

aburguesamiento dicen que desde la dcada de

1970, el capitalismo empez a operar de modo

distinto, donde se a alejado de -- o no es que se

haya alejado de -- pero se ha vuelto a la ciudad,

a las zonas centrales de ciudades que se

haban descuidado en mayor parte, durante

las primeras etapas del desarrollo capitalista.

Estn regresando a esas zonas porque hoy da

la ubicacin y la proximidad es mucho ms

importante en cuanto a produccin de valor.

As que eso es un argumento, y se puede

detallar ms, pero eso es ms o menos lo

bsico.

Hay otro argumento que dice que se trata de

nuevos consumidores, y la gente que est

eligiendo otras formas de consumir, y quiere

vivir en las zonas centrales por su esttica, o


29/208

28

live in these downtown areas because of the

aesthetics, or because of their type of work.

For example, if they're lots of flexible

positions, or they're in the creative industries,

or cognitive industries, where they may have

a few jobs that they do, or they freelance a lot,

being around other people who do similar

stuff, or job opportunities makes a lot more

sense. So people tend to gravitate now

towards these centers because of the type of

workforce that exists.

That said, those are all just really big general

ideas that people have used to try to apply to

gentrification in different areas. When you

start taking that stuff, and you put it on the

ground, everything gets real messy. What I

think we are seeing here [in Santa Ana] is a

mix of both. I think definitely the Marxist

geographers are right. I think capitalism is

different today then it was in our parents'

generation. The driving forces of capitalism

are different. I think we all know this, just

growing up with all the technology that we

have, and the emphasis on creative industries,

and arts, and how the art world and the

por la naturaleza de su trabajo. Por ejemplo, si

tienen trabajos flexibles, o si forman parte de

las industrias creativas, o industrias

cognitivas, donde tal vez tengan un par de

trabajos, o hacen trabajo freelance

[independiente} a menudo, estar cerca a gente

que hace cosas parecidas, o cerca de

oportunidades de empleo, tiene sentido. As

que, la gente es atrada a estas zonas por la

naturaleza de la fuerza laboral.

Esos son los esquemas generales se han usado

para entender el aburguesamiento en

distintas reas. Cuando empiezas a aplicar la

teora a la realidad en el suelo, las cosas se

complican bastante. [Aqu en Santa Ana], creo

que estamos viendo una mezcla de las dos.

Claro, creo que los gegrafos marxistas tienen

razn. El capitalismo es diferente hoy a lo que

era durante la generacin de nuestros padres.

Las fuerzas impulsoras son distintas. Todos lo

sabemos, creo, porque crecimos con gran

cantidad de tecnologa, y con hincapi en las

industrias creativas, y en las artes. Slo al ver

como el mundo de las artes y la produccin de

valor se han unido tan estrechamente.


30/208

29

production of value have come together in a

very strong way. I think that's just a real

larger background.

I don't think its necessarily consumers that

are driving it. I'm on the sort of the heritage of

the Marxist geographers, that's where I stake

my claim. I see that as being the predominate

driving force. But underneath that, when you

start looking at the ground level, you see

people with real power who make decisions.

Those are politicians, developers, in

particular, and property owners, banks as

well, and a whole network, almost this sort of

financial structure that's involved in land and

real-estate development, that are really

important. Because people see the importance

of proximity, they see the potential of

proximity and downtown locations for higher

returns.

So they do developments that end up pushing

people out and create the city in their own

image, and what they want to see.

Eso, lo considero como un esquema general

ms grande.

No creo que sean los consumidores que lo

estn impulsando. Yo pertenezco a la herencia

de los gegrafos marxistas, me identifico con

ellos. Veo que esa es la fuerza impulsora

principal. Pero por debajo de eso, cuando

empiezas a considerar la base, hallas que la

gente con verdadero poder es la que toma

decisiones. Son los polticos, los inmobilarios,

en particular, los dueos de propiedad, bancos

tambin, una red entera, casi una estructura

financiera que est involucrada en lo que es el

desarrollo de propiedades y inmobiliarias;

ellos son muy importantes. Porque la gente

reconoce la importancia de la proximidad, y

reconoce el potencial que tiene la proximidad,

y zonas centrales, en trminos de mayor

ganancias.

As que construyen cosas nuevas que

terminan por echar a la gente, y forman una

ciudad segn su propia imagen, y segn lo que

quieren ver.


31/208

30

I think that's definitely the case, from what I

understand here in Santa Ana -- that it's about

developers and it's about politicians making

plans for Santa Ana that they want to re-

invent it. I think that's the history with the

Artist's Village, that it was an intentional

effort on the part of people to remake Santa

Ana, to stake a claim, to reterritorize it, in a

sense, away from it's Mexican and Latino

heritage. I think that's the conflict that I see,

that's going on here in Santa Ana.

- Urban Studies Researcher

Por lo que entiendo de Santa Ana, creo que ese

es el caso aqu -- se trata de inmobiliarias y se

trata de polticos haciendo planes para Santa

Ana, y se trata de que la quieren re-inventar.

Creo que eso es la historia del Artists Village,

fue un esfuerzo deliberado de gente que quera

otra Santa Ana, que queran invertir y

retomarla, en cierto sentido, retomarla de las

manos de su herencia Mexicana y Latina. Eso

es el conflicto que veo, que est ocurriendo

aqu en Santa Ana.

- Investigador de Estudios Urbanos


32/208

31

11. I mean the history of the art world is aboutgentrification because you can trace the

growth of a city or the gentrification of the

city through the art world. If you look at New

York its Times Square to the East Village, to

Soho to Chelsea, to Williamsburg and the

Brooklyn area. In Los Angeles, it started in

Pasadena and went over to downtown and

then Mid Wilsher, and then Venice, Santa

Monica, and now its in Culver City.

I think as an institution, a lot of times these

[Art] institutions get plopped down and they

just kind of push everything else out. With

that, in the art world, the artists get pushed

out once that other kind of gentrification

comes: the boutique shops, those other things.

But for an institution to move into a

community, it has to be responsible to the

community that it's moving into. Here, to plop

an arts scene into a community that's 89%

Hispanic, and really low income, you know,

4.6 people living per household, with 33,000

annual income, you have to be responsible and

La historia del mundo de Arte estada ligada al

aburguesamiento, porque uno puede trazar el

crecimiento de una ciudad, o el

aburguesamiento de una ciudad a travs del

mundo del Arte. Si uno ve la ciudad de New

York: fue de Times Square, al East Village, a

Soho, a Chelsea, a Williamsburg, y a la zona de

Brooklyn. En Los ngeles, empez en

Pasadena, y migr al centro, y entonces Mid

Wilsher, y despus a Venice, Santa Mnica, y

actualmente se encuentra en Culver City.

Como institucin, muchas veces se establecen

instituciones [de Arte], y bsicamente

expulsan a todo lo dems. Con eso, en el

mundo del arte, los artistas tambin se ven

expulsados una vez que llegue el otro tipo de

aburguesamiento: boutiques, y otras cosas as.

Pero para que una institucin se mude a una

comunidad, tiene que ser responsable haca la

comunidad a la que se muda. Aqu, instalar

una escena de artes en una comunidad que es

89% hispana, y de muy bajos ingresos, 4.6

personas por hogar, con un ingreso anual de


33/208

32

respectful to that community, and try to

figure out how to use your resources -- or not

how to use your resources -- how to provide

and allow those resources to be used by the

local community.

We're still trying to figure that out, but we're

trying to open our doors to invite as many

people in to say, "Look, here's the resources

we have, let's think together of ways to use

these, in a more respectful way, in a

responsible way, to, not just the people that

are in Downtown, but the people that live

south of 1st Street, or that live west of

Broadway, or live east of Lacy. How do we

engage those in better ways? We're working

with the Santa Ana Public Library to do the

project with the Raitt Street. We're working

with Garfield Elementary. We're trying to

branch out into Santa Ana in different ways,

using our resources through Artists in

Residence, and using funding and sources that

we can either fundraise for or collaboratively

fundraise for, to help support those efforts.

We're not going to be perfect, but we 're going

to try to do it in a more responsible way.

$33,000, uno tiene que ser responsable y

respetuoso haca esa comunidad, e intentar

usar esos recursos--o no cmo usar los

recursos -- pero como proveer y dejar que los

recursos sean usados por la comunidad local.

Todava lo estamos tratando de resolver, pero

estamos tratando de abrir las puertas e

invitar a la mayor cantidad de personas

posible para decir, Miren, estos son los

recurso que tenemos, pensemos juntos cmo

usarlos, de una forma ms responsable, en

provecho de, no solo la gente que estn en el

Centro, pero tambin en provecho de la gente

que vive al sur de la Calle 1, o al oeste de

Broadway, o al este de Lacy. Cmo podemos

involucrar a esa gente? Estamos trabajando

con la Biblioteca Pblica de Santa Ana para

hacer el proyecto con la Calle Raitt. Estamos

colaborando con la escuela Primaria

Garfield. Estamos tratando de involucrarnos

en Santa Ana de formas distintas, usando

nuestros recursos a travs de Artistas en

Residencia, usando fondos que podemos

recaudar nosotros mismo o en colaboracin

con otros, para ayudar con estos esfuerzos.


34/208

33

I think that's really important to be able to be

critical of yourself, and to be able to be

critiqued on a regular basis, and to have

diverse voices in this space, and to say that we

can agree to disagree, but how can we work

together, to move forward positively. Even

though we can disagree on extreme levels,

there's points that we can agree on. When it

comes down to it, we're all human. How do we

work to better our community as a whole?

- Art Center Director

No vamos a ser perfectos, pero vamos a

intentar hacerlo de una forma ms

responsable.

Creo que es muy importante poder ser crtico

de uno mismo, y poder ser criticado

regularmente, y tener voces diversas en este

espacio, y decir que nosotros podemos estar de

acuerdo con estar en desacuerdo; pero como

podemos colaborar, para seguir adelante de

forma positiva? Aunque podemos estar en

desacuerdo a niveles extremos, tambin hay

puntos en los cuales podemos ponernos de

acuerdo. Al final, todos somos humanos.

Cmo podemos trabajar para mejorar

nuestra comunidad entera?

- Director de Centro de Arte


35/208

34

12. The artist's issue is so complex. It's complexfor a couple reasons. One of them is the

question of who's an artist. If you think of

gentrification as this process that happens,

they say in stages, the prototypical or the

archetype of gentrification process is this:

There's an area that's disinvested, and it's

predominately low-income people of color. You

have artists come in who are looking for cheap

rents to be able to do their art, because they

are artists who are living very precariously.

No stable income, necessarily, maybe

fluctuating from different types of jobs, but

trying to devote as much time as possible to

their art.

Then, you have this thing where the

neighborhood becomes attractive to

speculators and entrepreneurial folks who

want to start up a new business. They move in

also because they can do it. It's not the

Starbucks coming in, it's people who are like,

I can actually throw in everything into this

business and maybe get it going.

El tema de los artistas es muy complejo. Es

muy complejo por un par de cosas. Una de

ellas es la pregunta de quin es artista. Si se

piensa en el aburguesamiento como un

proceso que se desarrolla por etapas, el

prototipo, o el arquetipo de un proceso de

aburguesamiento es este:

Existe una zona en la cual han dejado de

invertir recursos, principalmente es de

minoras de bajos ingresos. Entran los artistas

quienes buscan rentas bajas, econmicas para

seguir haciendo su arte, porque son artistas

quienes viven vidas muy precarias. Es

probable que no tengan un ingreso estable, tal

vez cambien de empleo a empleo, pero tratan

de dedicar la mayor cantidad de tiempo

posible a su arte.

Despus, pasa que el vecindario se hace

atractivo para los especuladores financieros y

empresarios. Tambin se mudan al vecindario

porque pueden. No son los Starbucks quienes

entran, es gente que piensa, de verdad puedo

invertirlo todo en este negocio, y tal vez sea

exitoso.


36/208

35

Things start to change, and it becomes hip.

Then it moves from hip to now you have these

larger folks coming in with more established

networks, finances and banks that can start

displacing some of the previous folks: the

entrepreneurial, commercial folks or old

commercial folks who have been there for a

long time, as well as very interestingly, some

of the early stage artists. You may have, now,

the city getting involved, and start doing these

large loft live/work spaces, which are bringing

in artists, but a different kind of artists, who

are able to pay a lot more money. So you have

maybe more established artists, artists that

work in fields that are more traditional.

Then there's the whole other issue of, whose

art is acknowledged? We talked about Santa

Ana having this district of quinceaera

dresses. There's an artwork to this that people

might not consider themselves as artists, but

they're clearly producing cultural works of

artistic value. This whole concept of who's an

artist, and what kind of artist is at what stage

of gentrification is really important.

Las cosas empiezan a cambiar, y el vecindario

se convierte en algo suave, novedoso. Despus

pasa de ser novedoso a que ahora se estn

mudando comerciantes ms grandes, con

redes ms establecidas con fuentes de fianzas

y bancos, y ellos empiezan a desplazar a la

gente que viva ah antes: los primeros

empresarios y comerciantes que entraron, o

los antiguos comerciantes que llevan toda la

vida ah, y tambin, interesantemente, a

algunos de los primeros artistas. Tal vez ahora

se involucre la ciudad, y empieza a invertir en

estos departamentos tipo live/work [espacios

para vivir y trabajar], lo cual atrae a artistas,

pero otro tipo de artistas, artistas que puedan

pagar mucho ms. As que, tienes artistas ms

establecidos, artistas quienes trabajan en

ramos ms tradicionales, entre comillas.

Despus hay la cuestin de: qu consideras

como arte? Hablamos de Santa Ana y su

distrito de tiendas que vendan vestidos de

quinceaera. Hay arte en eso, y tal vez la

gente no se considere a si mismo artista, pero

claramente producen obras culturales de

valor artstico. El concepto de quien es artista,


37/208

36

That's not for me to tell the artists, "this is

your stand." But I know that from friends, not

necessarily artists, so much, but I think

there's a parallel to this, with organizers. In

LA Ive known a lot of organizers that work on

community rights, anti-gentrification work.

Like you were saying, they're educated, they

went to school, they got radicalized, and they

want to give back. So they dedicate their lives

to work and to help empower people. Those

folks, like everybody else, they're moving into

the neighborhoods that they want to live in,

that they feel have value, and they can afford,

because they're also organizers, so they're not

making a ton of money. They're going in, and

they're struggling with this issue of "are we

contributing to gentrification?"

This is a fight I have with people all the time. I

don't think that when we start to find out

causality, right, who's causing gentrification --

I think these folks that are coming in on that

level are really the products of decisions that

have already been made before them by

people with much more power, so we go back

to property owners, developers, banks --

y qu tipo de artista corresponde a cul etapa

del aburguesamiento es muy importante.

No es mi lugar decirle a los artistas, esta es

su postura. Pero s de eso por mis amigos, no

son artistas, sino organizadores comunitarios,

y creo que existe cierta relacin entre ambos

grupos . En Los Angeles, he conocido a muchos

organizadores que trabajan en pro de

derechos comunitarios, y contra el

aburguesamiento. Como estabas diciendo, son

educados, fueron a la universidad, se

radicalizaron, y quieren dar algo de vuelta a

sus comunidades. As que, dedican las vidas a

trabajar para ayudar y empoderar a la gente.

Ellos, como todos, se estn mudando a

vecindarios donde quieren vivir, que sienten

que tienen valor, y son econmicos para ellos,

porque son organizadores y por lo tanto no

tienen grandes cantidades de dinero. Se estn

mudando, y estn luchando con esta cuestin:

Estamos contribuyendo al

aburguesamiento?

Eso es algo que discuto con gente a cada rato.

Cuando empezamos a preguntar sobre las


38/208

37

people that really make the enabling decisions

for people to move into areas or to really start

displacing folks.

Because, I'll give you an example, if you were

to move into an area that wasn't gentrifying,

and wasn't going to gentrify, you're not going

to necessarily displace anybody. It's not you're

actions. It is cumulative actions. The only way

that these really large-scale shifts that involve

lots of people making the same types of

decisions happen, is because usually people

with power over property and development

have allowed this to happen.

You can have artist's communities in areas

that have never really displaced significant

numbers of people. But when that place

becomes hip, and developers and speculators

and entrepreneurial folks decide, we want to

re-territorialize this place and market it in a

new way, you start to see forces happen--

where the folks that were there before, that

may not have been gentrifiers, but just looking

for cheep rent, are now out, as well as the

community that was there before.

causas, verdad, quin est provocando el

aburguesamiento, no creo -- creo que la gente

entrando a ese nivel, es producto de

decisiones que ya se han tomado, por gente

mucho ms poderosa. De nuevo volvemos a los

propietarios, inmobiliarios, bancos. Esa es la

gente que de verdad toma las decisiones para

que otros se muden a esas reas, y para que

se empiece a desplazar a la gente

Porque, te voy a dar un ejemplo, si t te mudas

a una regin que no est experimentando

aburguesamiento, y no lo har, no desplazaras

a nadie. No son tus acciones; son las acciones

cumulativas. La nica forma de que ocurran

estos cambios a gran escala, es que muchos

toman la misma decisin: cuando la gente

poderosa, en trminos de propiedades y

desarrollo, permiten que suceda.

Puede haber comunidades de artistas en

regiones donde nunca se ha desplazado a

personas en cantidades considerables. Pero

cuando un lugar se convierte en algo

novedoso, y inmobiliarios y especuladores y


39/208

38

So in my work, I really emphasize them. I

really emphasize the role of property owners.

I think property owners have the most impact

on displacement, not necessarily -- you were

talking about you -- or my organizer friends,

or certain groups of artists. I do think it's good

that people are questioning their role, but I

also don't think they should beat themselves

up over it, because the real question is: when

there are struggles that happen, and the

community is getting organized, which side do

you stand on?

- Urban Studies Researcher

empresarios deciden, queremos retomar este

espacio y promocionarla de forma nueva,

entonces empiezas a ver cambios -- donde

gente que estaba antes, que tal vez no fueran

parte del aburguesamiento, quienes slo

buscaban rentas econmicas -- son

desplazados junto con la comunidad que

primero viva ah.

As que, en mi trabajo, enfatizo su influencia.

Enfatizo el papel de los propietarios. Creo que

los propietarios son los que ms controlan el

desplazamiento, no son -- ustedes estaban

hablando de si mismos, tampoco son mis

amigos que son organizadores, y tampoco es

un grupo determinado de artistas. S, creo que

es bueno que la gente cuestione su impacto,

pero no creo que uno se debe castigar a si

mismo, porque la verdadera pregunta es:

cundo surjan las luchas, y cundo la

comunidad se organice, de qu lado estars?

- Investigador de Estudios Urbanos


40/208

39

VOL. I --

CONTEXTO /

CONTEXT

Participantes / Participants:

Gustavo Arellano

Erualdo Gonzles

Victor Payn

Pocha Pea

Sam Romero

Robert Santana

Revel Sims

John Spiak


41/208

40


42/208

VOL. II --

RECUERDOS

MEMORIES


43/208


44/208

43

01. Yo tengo 58 aos aqu, con mi tienda. Tengo65 de estar trabajando en la Calle Cuatro.

Comenc en la edad de 17 aos, ahorita tengo

83, y todava estoy trabajando. Por eso les

digo, la evolucin en el tiempo de los 40s y 50s

era-- haba mucha gente aqu. Pero era mixta.

Eran Mxico-americanos que fueron los

primeros clientes que tuvimos eran Mxico-

americanos. Poco a poco se fue yendo a los

malls, y ya no vinieron, as fue cuando entr el

mexicano.

Al mexicano lo miraban muy abajo, verdad, en

primer lugar. Uno vena al pueblo pero vena

muy despichadito, y de la [Calle] Main para

ac era donde se congregaban ms. Haba mas

gente aqu, verdad, el mexicano. De la Main

para all era de las Macy's, que hay ahorita de

las Nordstrom y de esas all, eran tiendas de

lo mejor. Haba una all en lo que es el edifico

de cinco pies que est cerca de [Fallas]

Paredes, en frente, esa era la Renkins. Era

Renkins. Era de pura gente de dinero. En

frente estaba Van Deusens, estaba la Hugh J.

Lowe y bueno pues-- pero pura gente de

[dinero]--Por eso

My store and I have been here for 58 years.

Ive been working on 4th Street for 68. I

started when I was 17, Im 83 now, and Im

still working. Thats why I tell you, the

evolution from the 40s and 50s was--there

were a lot of people here. But they were a mix.

They were Mexican-Americans, and they were

the first clients we had, they were Mexican

Americans. Little by little they went to shop at

the malls, they didnt come here anymore, and

thats when the Mexicans came.

In the first place, Mexicans were looked down

upon. Youd come into town, but youd be

reserved, and from Main [Street] to here was

where youd get together more. Most of the

Mexicans came here. From Main and on over

that way, were the stores like Macys, which

you see now with Nordstrom, they were the

luxury stores. One of them was there, in that

five-story building thats close to [Fallas]

Paredes, in front of it, that was Renkins. It

was Renkins. It was for people with money. In

front of that was Van Deusens, and also Hugh

J. Lowe, and well-- but only for people with

[money]-- So thats


45/208

44

muchas veces vena uno ac [de este lado] a

ver si haba zapatos de dos o tres dlares.

La gente de Mxico no lleg aqu hasta los 70s.

Haba, pues, gente. Haba como nosotros. Yo

soy nacido aqu en la ciudad. Pero era, multi-

Mxico-americanos y americanos. Y haba

mas y mas en la Calle Cuatro, despus ya como

y en la evolucin del tiempo, comenz a llegar

el mexicano de Mxico como en 1970s: 72,

73. Y es lo que mas tenemos. Lo que es la

Calle Cuatro en ese tiempo estaba muy solo,

haba espacios [comerciales] donde cambiarse

uno de aqu al otro. Nosotros en ese tiempo se

nos quem la finca que tenamos nosotros. Y

para tener-- ramos cuatro comerciantes que

estaban aqu y todos comenzaron y

encontraron un lugar en el siguiente cuadra,

porque estaba solo. Santa Ana era un pueblo

de tierra sin gente. Y eso fue lo que revivi al

la ciudad de Santa Ana fueron mexicanos.

- Dueo de Negocio en la Calle Cuatro [#3]

why a lot of times youd come [here] looking

for two to three dollar shoes.

People from Mexico didnt get here until the

70s. There were people, of course. There were

people like us. I was born here in the city. But

the city was multi- Mexican-Americans and

Americans. And 4th Street filled more and

more with the passing of time, when Mexicans

started to come from Mexico around the

1970s: 72, 73. And thats what we mostly

have here now. Back then what is 4th Street

now was very lonely, there were enough

[shop] spaces to move from here to there.

Back then, the building that we had burned

down. And in order to-- there were four of us

business owners here, and we all started

[looking] and found a place in the next block

over because there wasnt anything else there.

Santa Ana was a town with land without

people. What brought the city of Santa Ana to

life, what brought it back to life, were

Mexicans.

- 4thStreet Business Owner [#3]


46/208

45

02. La primera vez que llegu aqu a la ciudad deSanta Ana fue en 1959. Llegu aqu porque se

haba deshecho toda La Calle Cuatro. Llegu a

un centro comercial en La 17 y la Bristol que

se llama Honer Plaza-- es un nuevo desarrollo,

una plaza que se llev todos los comerciantes

de aqu. Y dejaron la calle vaca.

Yo vine de Los Angeles para abrir esta tienda.

Como yo trabajaba de asistente de gerente de

una joyera, abrieron la joyera aqu a los dos o

tres meses antes de que yo viniera, en octubre

del 59, y luego me mandaran en diciembre. Me

gust, me gust la idea, era un pueblo

pequeo, estaba enfocado sobre la 17 y la

Bristol, donde estaba la Woolworths, la

JCPenney.

La mayora de todas las tiendas que estaban

aqu se fueron para all. Las otras tiendas

mejores de calidad se fueron a lo que es ahora

Main Place [Mall]. En aquel tiempo se llam

Fashion Square. Y ah vino una tienda que se

llama Bullocks--que es la que ahora es Macys--

[fue] una de las tiendas ms elegantes de Los

Angeles.

The first time I came, here, to the City of Santa

Ana was in 1959. I came here because all of

4th Street had emptied out. I came to a

shopping mall on 17th Street and Bristol,

which was called Honer Plaza-- it was a new

development, a plaza that took all of the

business owners away from here. They left the

street empty.

I came from Los Angeles to open this store. I

worked as an assistant manager in a jewelry

store, so when they opened a jewelry store

here in October of 59--two or three months

before I came--they sent me, in December. I

liked it, I liked the idea. It was a small town

concentrated on 17th Street and Bristol,

where Woolworths was, and JC Penney.

The majority of the stores that were here

moved there. The other, higher-end stores

went over to what is now Main Place [Mall]. In

those days it was called Fashion Square. And

thats where a store named Bullocks--which

these days is a Macysopened, it was one of

the fanciest stores from Los Angeles.


47/208

46

Yo vine con esta compaa y me qued aqu y

empec a mirar la Calle Cuatro, estaba vaca.

Entonces durante los aos que estuve

viniendo empec a pensar en abrir un

negocio, y abr una discoteca; se llamaba

Disco Shop, a la vuelta en la Broadway.

Porque todo estaba vaco, no haba gente.

Eventualmente, despus de los aos, en el 60,

70 yo empec a frecuentar ms la Calle

Cuatro. Tuve xito en esa tienda. Y abrimos

este lugar, que se convirti en Disco Shop,

como se llamaba la tienda.

Y luego, claro, fuimos y abrimos ms. Y todas

las calles se empezaban a llenar con Latinos,

con todas las personas que haban aqu, todo

de Mexicanos. Y empezaron a llegar

[Empresarios] Latinos, y llenar las tiendas

vacas. La Joyera Maya que estaba de aquel

lado, haba otro que se llamaba el Discoteca

Mxico cerca de FrenchY luego vinieron

ms alrededor, empezaron a enfocarse en el

negocio Latino. Yo, principalmente con mi

discoteca, empec a tocar msica fuerte,

msica ranchera como Los Alegres de Tern.

I came with this company, and I stayed here,

and I began to admire 4th Street, which was

empty. And so during the years that I came

down here, I began to think about opening up

a business. I opened up a nigh club, it was

called Disco Shop, around the corner on

Broadway. Because everything was empty

here, there werent any people. Eventually,

after some years, in the sixties, or in 70, I

began to go to 4th Street more. I was

successful with my store. And we opened this

place, which turned into Disco Shop, which

the name of the store.

And then, of course, we went and we opened

more. All of the streets began to fill with

Latinos, with everybody that used to be here,

all of them Mexican. And Latino [Businesses]

began coming in and filling the empty shops.

The Joyera Maya, which is over that way,

there was another one called the Discoteca

Mexico near French StreetAnd after that,

more came, and they began focusing on a

Latino market. In my record store, I began to

play loud music, ranchera [Mexican Western]

music, like Los Alegres de Tern. Do you


48/208

47

Conoces a ese grupo? Las Jilguerillas. Ese

tipo de msica.

Y tenamos mucha clientela mexicana. Mi

esposa aprendi a hablar espaol bien. Mis

hijos nacieron aqu. Comenz a llenarse La

Cuatro.

Eventualmente [como] en el 85, se empez a

remodelar la calle. Y entonces se empez a

hacer mas eventos, el primero 5 de Mayo se

hizo como en 85, 1985. Los comerciantes

abrimos una organizacin de comerciantes se

llamaba DSABA: Downtown Santa Ana

Business Association, as que fue la primera

organizacin de comerciantes en general, no

solamente Latinos. Pero siendo Latinos, claro,

que organizamos el 5 de Mayo; hicimos un

gran fiestn, trajimos muchos artistas

conocidos, de nombre, como Lucha Villa,

Resortes, Beatriz Adriana

Yo, cuando abr este lugar, traje a Las

Jilguerillas, les deca mis comadres porque

las conoca y tambin traje a un muchacho que

se llamaba Cepilln.

know that group? Las Jilguerillas. That type

of music.

And we had a lot of Mexican clientele. My wife

learned to speak Spanish well. My kids were

born here. And 4thstreet boomed.

Eventually, [around] 85, they started

remodeling the street. And then they began to

put on a lot more events, the first 5 de Mayo

happened in 85, 1985. Business owners, we

founded an association for businesses, it was

called DSABA; the Downtown Santa Ana

Business Association, and thats how the first

organization for business owners came about,

which was not only [for] Latinos. But as there

were Latinos, of course, we organized the 5 de

Mayo; we put on huge party, we brought a lot

of well known artists, like Lucha Villa,

Resortez, Beatriz Adriana

When I opened this place, I brought in Las

Jilguerillas, I called them my comadres

[friends] because I knew them well, and I also

brought in a kid who performed as a clown, his

name was Cepilln.


49/208

48

Ese tiempo tambin cuando hicimos ese

evento se llen la calle, se llen la calle de pura

gente, y la polica vino a tratar de dirigir el

trfico. La primera vez que vinieron artistas

de renombre. Y luego Cepilln fue rodeado por

los nios, tuvo fotos y fotos y fotos ah afuera.

Seguimos aos tras aos haciendo el 5 de

Mayo, trajimos a casi como 200,000 personas

viernes, sbado y domingo.

De ah se empez hacer la calle ms famosa.

Todos los comerciantes participaron, todos

pusieron su granito. Y desde ese tiempo que yo

era presidente de la asociacin, que empec a

organizar algo, me enfocaba yo sobre La

Cuatro, que se convirtiera en una calle,

promenade, un paseo como lo hay en Santa

Monica, y hay en varias ciudades. Yo he

viajado mucho en Mxico, en Europa y he

visto muchas calles que estn anchas y hay

mucho lugar donde no trafican automvil, las

cerraron. Entonces era eso lo que yo me

enfocaba en hacer aqu. Y siendo el presidente

de la asociacin y tener contacto con las

autoridades gubernamentales, les propuse

eso, y les propuse a los comerciantes locales

At the time when we put on the event, the

street just filled with people, and the police

came to try to direct transit. The first time

that really famous artists were here. And

children mobbed Cepillin and began to take

picture after picture with him right outside.

We continued, year after year, to do the 5 de

Mayo wed bring almost 200,0000 people to

the area, on Friday, Saturday, and Sunday.

Thats when the street began being famous. All

of the businessmen took part, everyone

chipped in. And during that time, I was the

president of the association, and I began to

organize something, I concentrated on 4th

Street, I wanted to turn it into a promenade-

type street, like the one they have in Santa

Monica, and in other cities. Ive traveled

around Mexico a lot, and through Europe, and

Ive seen a lot of streets that are wide, where

cars arent allowed to drive, they close them.

So that was what I was focused on doing here.

And being the president of the association,

and having contact with the government

authorities, I proposed that to them, and I

proposed it to the local businesses


50/208

49

No lo aceptaron. Porque iba a costar dinero.

Pero yo me imaginaba este lugar cerrado, sin

carros o trfico, malabaristas en el medio,

payasos, cantantes. Usted ha estado en una

ciudad que se llama Quertaro? - Es una

ciudad muy colonial, las calles del centro

histrico la cerraron y los das de fiestas se

pone muy bonito

- Dueo de Negocio en la Calle Cuatro [#2]

They didnt approve it. Because it was going to

cost money.

But I imagined a closed off space,

[...inaudible...] traffic, jugglers in the middle,

clowns, singers. Have you been to a city thats

called Queretaro? Its a very colonial city, they

closed the streets in the historical center, and

holidays there are very beautiful



51/208

50

03. Let's see, what is my relationship to downtownSanta Ana? Well, that I love it, dearly. The

reason-- I was born just half a mile from here,

in the Logan Area. I recall coming to

downtown when I was a little girl, probably

six-seven years old, maybe younger, running

into some of the businesses, and giving my

parent's payments.

Then, just like now, we could never find

parking in Downtown, and so they would stop

in front of R&R Sportswear, with Mr. Ray

Rangel, and I gave my dad's payments for his

clothing, he would buy all his work clothes and

western wear [there]. Then, Zales Jewelers,

back then their Jewelry, that was where they

had their account, and I can go on and on.

So we would spend a lot of time here. We

would walk to Downtown and on Saturdays,

we would come I remember and have those

delicious hot dogs. If I recall correctly, it was

on Grant. I don't recall exactly, but I know it

was on the East-Side. I spent a lot of time here.


A ver, cual es mi relacin con el centro de

Santa Ana? Bueno, que lo amo. La razn-- nac

a media milla de aqu, en el barrio de Logan.

Recuerdo que de nia vena al centro, cuando

tena mas o menos seis o siete aos, tal vez era

ms joven, entraba corriendo a los negocios, a

entregar los pagos de mis padres.

Entonces -- justo como ahora -- nunca

encontraban estacionamiento en el Centro, as

que paraban en frente de R&R Sportswear,

con el Seor Ray Rangel, y [yo] daba el pago

de la ropa de mi padre, l compraba todo su

ropa para el trabajo y su ropa vaquera ah.

bamos a la joyera Zales, en ese entonces era

su joyera, donde tenan su cuenta, y puedo

seguir y seguir.

As que pasbamos mucho tiempo aqu.

Caminbamos al Centro, y los sbados

recuerdo que venamos, y tenan esos hot dogs

deliciosos-- si recuerdo bien era en la calle

Grant. No recuerdo exactamente, pero s que

era en la parte ste. Pas mucho tiempo aqu.

- Duea de Negocio en la Calle Cuatro [#1]


52/208

51

04. The major shoe store in Mexico is opening upa Canada [store] on 4th and Main. They must

know something, or they're banking on

something. My mom started working there.

She was working there, first as a sales person,

and then really quickly became a manager.

I was born in 74, since then, as a kid my early

memories are going with my dad to go visit my

mom: closing three hours before, hanging out,

walking down 4th Street, waiting for your

mom to get out of work, and just walking up

and down 4th street on my dad's shoulders.

And that's it. Youre going to 4th street: Vas a

La Cuatro, vas a La Cuatro, vas a La Cuatro.

My mom worked there from 73 up until 84--

because my brother was born in 84. You see

for the first ten years of my life, I would go

there: in the summers, or the weekends--my

mom's a manager, so she could take me. These

are the 70s. You hang out there, listen to

records, or help clean the windows or the shoe

display.

La gran tienda de calzados en Mxico est

abriendo una [tienda] Canada en La Cuatro y

Main. Deben saber algo, o estn contando con

algo. Mi mama empez a trabajar all.

Trabajaba all primero como vendedora y muy

rpido se hizo gerente.

Nac yo en el 74, y desde ese entonces mis

primeros recuerdos como nio son de ir con

mi papa a visitar a mi mama: son de cerrar

tres horas antes, de pasar un rato juntos, de

pasear por La Cuatro, de esperar a que tu

mama saliera, y slo de pasear por La

Cuatro sobre los hombros de mi papa. Y eso

es. Vas a La Cuatro. Vas a La Cuatro, vas a La

Cuatro, vas a La Cuatro.

Mi mama trabaj all hastadel 73 hasta el

84-- porque nac

Borderblaster (SNA) // La Cuatro (Vol. 1-4)

Documents

Transcript of Borderblaster (SNA) // La Cuatro (Vol. 1-4)